- Let's again try crowd-sourcing. We finish with Epicurus today, and hear Chloe's presentation. Chloe, you can post your discussion questions in a comment here.
I'll post mine after y'all post yours...- What do you think of Epic's definition of a world? 159 Do you think he had a notion that each world could have its own laws of nature (rather than the natural universe being governed by a single set of natural laws, which seems to be the modern "correct" view)?
- When Epic applies the criterion of "running counter to our experience" to cosmology, how does he or the cosmologists of his time know anything of what worlds do? --unless he is indeed generalizing universally from earthly experience. And how can he claim to know that the planets, moon, etc. were not separately created? 160
- Can we be sure our reliance on the "clear evidence" of the senses is not an alternate form of "mythologizing"? 166
- Astrology is "worthless," I'm sure we agree, but is it because of the "one-cause" method? 171
- Do you share Epic's contempt for those who imagine "some divine being" who sits and watches animals in hibernation etc.? 172
- Is it the same mistake to say one shouldn't study philosophy or seek happiness prior to some designated age? 178
- Do you agree with Epic's definition of "the irreligious man"? 179
- If you're not afraid to die, should you automatically expect there to be "nothing fearful in living"? 180
- Do you "prefer the most savory dish to the largest portion..."?
- What's Epic saying, when he declares the future "neither ours nor altogether not ours"? 181
- Will a good Epicurean really "never experience anxiety" and live like a god," with no emotional peaks or valleys? 185, 192 Would you miss your peaks?
- Do you believe death is really "no different than if we had never been born at all," even if we rule out a punitive afterlife? 188
- Having imbibed the Epicurean message, do we "no longer need unlimited time"? 199 [Let's remember to revisit this question when we read 4,000 Weeks...]
- Is life "ruined by procrastination"? 204 How well do you resist procrastination? Any tips?
- Must we "laugh and philosophize..."? 205 And "remain cheerful"? 206 Do you?
- Is friendship the heart of "the gospel of the happy life"? Why call it a gospel?
- Is Vatican quote #68 the wisest statement in this book? 207
Before we say goodbye to Epicurus, in case you've not seen Alain de Botton's take on him and his school yet...
According to Epicurus, how do "noncelestial physics" differ from celestial physics? P. 158
ReplyDeleteSeems like he's making an astronomically-unscientific distinction between singular and multiple causal explanations. But he's not real clear about that. What does anyone else think?
DeleteHere are some of my discussion questions that I have come up with, the page numbers on some might be difficult as I have the online format of the book, just to make everyone aware.
ReplyDelete1. Is it possible for individuals who adhere to religious beliefs to reconcile Epicurus’s notion that deities remain uninvolved in human affairs?
2. Can a wise person still experience happiness when enduring torment considering the hedonistic view?
3. How can certain events be considered “determined” without any intervention from higher beings? What factors play a role in determining outcomes in such a context?
4. Do you find yourself more inclined to prioritize concerns related to your own well-being or those pertaining to others?
5. Can all aspects of existence be distilled solely to what we encounter in the material world? Are there arguments to support or challenge this perspective?
6. In our current age, marked by various challenges, is Epicurus’s counsel to “seek your own security and peace of mind” (67) still relevant and appropriate?
7. Is it possible to embrace hedonism while also recognizing the significance of friendship’s in one’s life?
2. I think Epicurus would say yes. His idea of unperturbability would seem to suggest that the wise man should be unaffected by external circumstances, remaining internally "unperturbed".
DeleteYou've gone over and beyond, Chloe, if these are all pertinent to your presentation. (And if they aren't, I still appreciate your industry.) We just need a couple of presentation-relevant questions from each presenter. You can pick two.
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think of Epic's definition of a world? 159 Do you think he had a notion that each world could have its own laws of nature (rather than the natural universe being governed by a single set of natural laws, which seems to be the modern "correct" view)?
ReplyDeleteEpicurus defines a world simply by describing his understanding of the world he lives in. He states, "A world is a circumscribed section of the heavens and includes a sun, moon, stars, an earth, and all that occurs in the heavens..." (Epicurus, 159). In this sense, he negates the possibility of a world without the same familiar, celestial presences. However, when describing how a world may come to fruition, there seems to be a bit more lee-way. An atomist, he refers to any worldly material or group of atoms that are to become a circumscribed section of the heavens and Earth as matter or atoms alone, as opposed to assuming rock or dirt or fire should be what designs the new world. He could be proposing the existence or potential creation of matter that is unknown to his kind, or unnative to his world. He believes firmly in the presence of atoms to, by chance or by design, interact with each other to bring about some creation, though does not place limits on how they might do so. I believe he is allowing for the possibility of a new set of natural laws, I just don't think he knew how to articulate that possibility without relying on the laws from his own world.
Astrology is "worthless," I'm sure we agree, but is it because of the "one-cause" method? 171
ReplyDeleteFirstly, I vehemently disagree that astrology is worthless, for the same reasons I would defend spirituality and religion: astrology is a method people employ to make sense of their world, themselves, and the people in it; there is innate value in learning why peoples practiced it.
If I am missing philosophical context, don't be afraid to let me know, but it seems as though Epicurus' understanding of astrologers is that they deemed the stars' origins, existences, and purposes as purely astrological in nature. As in, this would be to deny any natural or scientific findings and explanations that have been somewhat proven already. If this is the case, I would say the "one-cause" method is definitely a large factor in his conclusion of astrologers' ignorance. A man of science, this attributing of a million natural and complex phenomena to one theology with questionable epistemology seems like something that might frustrate him.
Born in February 341 BC, he'd be considered either an aquarius or a pisces. I've attached an article on astrological origins so that we may better understand why the practice has, at the very least, historical merit.
Delete"Astrology, then, arose as a natural extension of a cultural tradition of 'stories time-keeping' essential to man's survival and evolution" (122, Jerome).
https://www.jstor.org/stable/1572687?seq=2
I agree that calling it worthless is not the right way to go. To call someone's way of thinking worthless is far too harsh than how we should be acting.
DeleteMust we "laugh and philosophize..."? 205 And "remain cheerful"? 206 Do you?
ReplyDeleteGod yes, this is so so important. I’ve said it a few times before, but education has radically changed my viewpoint on life, philosophy being one of the big catalysts. Yet with this new knowledge that I acquire every day, comes the crushing realization of how little we really know, and how few people are willing to accept that. Most people, seem to think that knowledge is stagnant, that what they know now is all they will ever need to know. But if they looked at the world around them, they would realize that stagnation almost always equals certain death. But I can’t tell them this, because these people are my parents, my leaders, my pastors, my friends. I can’t tell them that there’s a possibility that they in fact don’t have all the answers, because I would be going against their philosophies, the ones I claim to share with them. It’s a paralyzing circle, with no end in sight. I could choose to lay down and let it consume me. Or I can laugh about it. I can choose to accept the reality of my situation and still be able to find the humor in it. Laughter is the ultimate defiance. Happiness is the sharpest weapon and the softest refuge. The ability to find the good is the ultimate thumbing of the nose to those who oppress and ignore.
Is life "ruined by procrastination"? 204 How well do you resist procrastination? Any tips?
ReplyDeleteI agree with this whole heartedly. Procrastination is the stifler of opportunity and the defeater of aspiration. It plagues those with mental health issues, convincing them they are lazy, unmotivated, and a waste of space. I hate procrastination, and I hate how much it controls me. I’m fortunate to have a great support system that picks me up when I fail, but if life had dealt me a less fortunate hand, procrastination would have most certainly have ruined my life by this point.
As for tips, I’ve learned that those who procrastinate often do so because they do not have the psychobiological ability to create correct amounts of dopamine. This is possible for a number of reasons: they could have been born with a low dopamine levels, or it could be due to over saturation within a high dopamine environment for long periods of unbroken time. This changes the brain’s dopamine receptors, causing them to be less sensitive to lower levels of dopamine, to protect itself from mania. The brains of people who procrastinate are not broken, they are just wired differently, thus requiring different methods of achieving the highest possibility of success. I personally procrastinate because of both reasons stated previously, which is why I have an incredibly difficult time getting stuff done, even if I really want to do it. But learning about my mental state has made it easier for me to adapt to my situation and overcome my personal obstacles. Here are some things I do:
Make it a competition: If I have a pressing assignment I need to get done, but have literally no motivation to do it, I will call a friend in that same class to meet up for an assignment competition. We meet somewhere other people can see us and our screens, like the library or a cafe, set a timer, and hash out what needs to get done. If I win, they might let me borrow their Copic markers, and if they win, I might give them a ride to their favorite off campus restaurant. Either way, when we finish we will both be happy, the work will be done, and we will have someone to compare answers to before submission. And hopefully, fun can be found along the way.
DeleteAggressively schedule: I mean it. When creating a routine for a certain thing you want to get done, think through everything you want to get done within said routine and write it down, including times. Often times, when I see just how much really has to go into completing a project or set of events, it will give me enough healthy stress to get it done. An example of this would be when I wake up in the morning. I know for a fact that it takes me five minutes to wake up and get to my bathroom, two minutes to brush my teeth, two minutes to wash my face, and one minute to put my contacts in. Then it takes my another ten minutes to put my makeup on and another ten to pick an outfit and create some buffer space between events. Then I know I have to fill up my water bottle, which takes me two and a half minutes, and another three minutes to grab a breakfast bar and get to my car. I absolutely know that no matter how fast I go, it will always take me at least twenty minutes to get to school. It will then take another twenty minutes to get on the bus and get to class. All together, I absolutely know for an empirical fact that it will take me at the very least an hour and fifteen and a half minutes to complete my morning routine with very little room for error. This concrete knowledge that I have tested many a time helps overcome the innate desire to stay in bed just a little longer.
DeleteHave a support system: Self accountability is hard to maintain for someone who procrastinates. If I say, “I will only go on my phone after I get my homework done,” but I am the only one enforcing that rule, I know for a fact I will break it. Take the option away from yourself and place it in the hands of someone you trust. Set up a system where you go a friend or family member who is sound of mind, tell them in detail what needs to be done, give them all of your distractions (phone, screen privacy, snacks, etc), and tell them they can only return those things when you show them solid proof of your completed tasks. I guarantee they will hold you more accountable than you will hold yourself, because they care about your future wellbeing more than you care about your momentary pleasure.
DeleteMake it aesthetic: This is how I overcame the hate and procrastination I held towards math. I turned it into something I thought was cool. Take something that you hate but need to do; let’s say, cleaning your home. What I do when I need to clean my space is to watch studio ghibli movies. Ghibli movies demonstrate the beauty in turning the mundane into a personal joy, and I use the happiness the characters are shown feeling on screen to power my own desire to feel that same happiness for myself. Romanticizing the things you hate make them so much easier to get through. When I am working on a difficult math problem, I envision myself as a Matilda, who was so hungry for knowledge that she was able to outshine everyone in her class, even with no prior experience in a classroom setting. When I’m writing an essay that I just can’t seem to get through, I think myself a sailor on a ship, thousands of miles from any shore, trying desperately to satiate his knowledge hungry mind by writing his thoughts about the few books the captain brought aboard the ship. It sounds crazy, but this type of self picturing has gotten me through many a procrastination pit.
DeleteFind someone you want to impress: I find that my favorite teachers I’ve ever had are often the ones my peers hate. This is often due to the teacher’s high expectations, which might be a hinderance for others, but it is something I’ve turned into a motivator for myself. Getting praised by someone everyone thinks is impossible to impress is one of the greatest highs I’ve ever had the pleasure of experiencing.
DeleteI have more tricks, but I think this post is already long enough. Please let me know if this is helpful!
What do you think of Epic's definition of a world?
ReplyDeleteIt seems that Epicurus filled defined his world in a similar manner to how he defined his metaphysics: through the observation he makes. For his time, this seems like a fine definition; however, we are not in his time. I feel our understanding of what a world is actually fits closer to the truth.